January 2007

It is false to compare satan’s religions, Hinduism, Buddhism, Islam, etc. with true Christian religion. I think the problem a lot of atheists have is that they put them all together, the fantasy and the truth.

I think many theists would agree with you, although the Hindus, Buddhists, Muslims, and any Christians that you would say are not “true” (Mormons?) would disagree with you about where the truth lies. You are correct, however, that atheists tend to lump all faith- or magic-based beliefs together, largely because they are, in their mode of thinking, often exactly the same.

Christianity is supported by evidence, by any measure it is a proven fact.

You need to define, “by any measure.” Having studied Christianity for decades, I find the evidence weaker now than I did when I first read the Bible.

If a court case had the evidence that exists for Christianity the jury would take 10 seconds to reach their verdict!

Possible — but then we’d probably disagree about what that verdict would be. You aren’t helping your case here by not defining what version of Christianity you are talking about. Catholicism? Protestantism? Jehovah’s Witness? Do you believe in faith healing? Creationism? Christianity is a big topic.

There are so many things in the Bible and the world that can’t be explained except through God.

An example would be nice.

False religions are clearly nonsense…

I agree that false religions are nonsense, and I would add to that that there are likely no non-false religions.

…they are full of ridiculous rubbish…

Like three deities that are really the same person, angels getting people pregnant, and talking donkeys?

…they don’t change people’s lives for the better or save souls.

There are likely no souls to save, but I would disagree about “false” religions changing people’s lives for the better. There are lots of people who find peace and a moral center after latching onto a belief system that frees them from the burdens of mortality and active morality. It’s kind of sad, really.

Anyone who really looks at different religions will see that everything except Christianity is insane.

There are billions of people who would disagree with you on this. People can be wrong without being insane. Even Christians.

People don’t accept it because they are corrupted by satan to believe lies (e.g. “good” people who worship false gods)…

And you think that it’s just for someone to be punished forever because a supernatural force has “corrupted” him so that he thinks lies are the trugh?

…or they hate God because they don’t want to follow his perfect moral laws.

Where are these perfect moral laws? Thou shalt punch a hole in your slave’s ear to show that he’s yours forever? Thou shalt not kill except in time of war, when commanded to by disembodied voices, to punish a wrongdoer, or if you’re hungry?

Neither of those are an excuse that God will accept, he can see into your heart.

Then God can see that I really, sincerely am trying to discover the truth of how the universe works and, at the same time, live a moral life. If he has perfect morality, then this should be sufficient.

You think people are threatening you with hell like it’s an empty blackmail attempt to get you to believe. Nothing could be further from the truth, that would only be true if hell didn’t really exist.

It doesn’t matter if Hell exists or not. Threatening someone with punishment if they do not believe in something is morally and intellectually vacuous. If someone broke into your house and said that he would torture and kill your family one at a time if you didn’t believe he was God, how long would it take you to truly believe he was God? And what if this person could see into your mind and know if you were lying? I’d guess that, no matter how much stress you were under, you could never accept the invader’s divinity without first becoming insane.

Hell is real and you will go there if you don’t worship your lord.

First off, I don’t have a lord. And if the only (or even the main) qualification for avoiding eternal punishment is worship, then I have another reason to question this perfect morality you spoke of.

I say this out of kindness in the hope that you can be spared from the fate you currently deserve.

I appreciate the thought, but why do I deserve an eternity of punishment just because I have not been convinced that your particular magic world view is metaphysically true? And what about people who do believe but do so in the “wrong” way? Do you condemn Mother Theresa, Gandhi, or Martin Luther King, Jr. to damnation because they chose the wrong religion?

God doesn’t send people to hell out of hate or to punish them, but because they have shown themselves to be unworthy of heaven. Would you want people who are weak minded, corrupt and immoral in paradise?

I understand not wanting the corrupt and the immoral (assuming they couldn’t be convinced to be otherwise), but “weak minded?” Are you saying dumb people deserve damnation? Or are you using “weak minded” to label people who are unable to make themselves believe in something they aren’t convinced exists?

They belong with satan in his pit of torture because that is what they have chosen for themselves. You have nobody to blame but yourselves!

So someone who was born, raised, and died a native American in the 16th century “chose” eternity in the pit of torture? You, my friend, seriously need to define your terms.

God loves you, I love you…

What do you even mean when you say such a thing? And does your love include condemning me because I am not convinced by your factless arguments?

…God is ready to accept you just allow yourself to give up your immoral ways and see the truth.

I don’t believe I’m living immorally, unless you define being immoral as not agreeing with you. And how does someone allow himself to “see the truth” without a logical reason to do so? How about this — I’ll work on allowing myself to believe in God as soon as you show me how by allowing yourself to realize Vishnu’s divinity. Deal?

It may make you uncomfortable to live a good life if you have been living is sinfullness, but you will be more happy.

I don’t recognize sinfulness since it implies the existence of God, but I believe that I live a moral life, and I’m quite happy this way, thank you very much.

I’m praying for you any I hope you can see sense before it’s too late.

I’m not praying for you, but I’m hoping that you, too, will “see sense.”

As a final thing to think about, compare these two quotations: “Happy the one who takes and dashes your little ones against the rock” and “Do not harm little children.” One of these is from the Psalms and the other is from the Satanic Bible. Guess which. It looks like, at least in this case, the competition has it all over you in the “perfect morality” department.

Posted on January 28, 2007 at 9:50 pm by ideclare · Permalink
In: Evidence

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